RoundTable Podcast – Transcription
Introduction
Elsie: Halo olgeta, I’m Elsie, welcome to the RoundTable Podcast. We’ve created this space for Ni-Vanuatu women to speak freely on issues affecting us today. Let’s navigate life in the islands together. Join me as I speak to a new guest every episode and ask the questions you’ve always wanted to ask. Ale yumi storian. This project is made possible with the support of the WeRise Coalition and PACMAS.
TRANSLATIONS: Hello everyone, I’m Elsie, welcome to the RoundTable Podcast. We’ve created this space for Ni-Vanuatu women to speak freely on issues affecting us today. Let’s navigate life in the islands together. Join me as I speak to a new guest every episode and ask the questions you’ve always wanted to ask. Let’s discuss. This project is made possible with the support of the WeRise Coalition and PACMAS.
Interview
Elsie (E): On this episode, we’re going to be talking about quite a sensitive topic. We will be exploring the perception of rape and victim blaming in Vanuatu. Now, this conversation may be triggering for some people so I am encouraging you, if you feel like listening to this episode may bring up something or may bring up past experiences then please, I highly suggest that you stop listening. But with me today to talk about this topic and explore more on this topic particularly in Vanuatu, I have Polly Walker-Dorras. Hi Polly, thank you for joining me today. Polly Walker, for those of you who might not know, she is the Senior Community and Gender lead for the Vanuatu-Australia Police and Justice Program, where she supports the Police and Justice agencies to develop and deliver community engagement initiatives around the law, particularly those that relate to domestic and sexual violence. So Polly, before we go into all of the questions that I have today, I just want to bring up this article that I found from the Daily Post from 2021, where the headline is ‘Collecting, analyzing and understanding gender-based violence data’. So it was an opportunity for all of the women-led organizations that look and work to help prevent violence against women and girls. And they had in this article according to the Vanuatu National Survey, Vanuatu has one of the highest recorded rates with 60% of women aged 15 to 49 experiencing physical and/or sexual violence, 68% experiencing emotional violence by an intimate partner in their lifetime. So these are some of the statistics, and I wanted to get your professional opinion. With these statistics, I want to know how many, in your opinion again, your professional opinion, how many of these women report these cases of violence, in particular the physical and sexual violence cases?
Polly Walker-Dorras (PWD): Ok so that’s quite a difficult question to answer, because we don’t actually know how many cases don’t get reported, we only collect data from people who come to police or people who go to an institution like the Vanuatu Women’s Center. But as we know, in Vanuatu many, many disputes are solved informally through the system of family heads or chiefs. So bae i dipen sapos we wan person hemi ripot, bae yumi save talem data blong this year we hemi kamaot long wanem seves we hemi ripot i go long hem. Be most long ol cases long belief blong mi, most long ol cases oli neva kasem wan formal seves, most long ol cases yumim handelem nomo insaed long famle o sam taem yumi pasem i go long jif.
TRANSLATIONS: Ok so that’s quite a difficult question to answer, because we don’t actually know how many cases don’t get reported, we only collect data from people who come to the police or people who go to an institution like the Vanuatu Women’s Center. But as we know, in Vanuatu many, many disputes are solved informally through the system of family heads or chiefs. So it just depends on if the person reports, then we’ll be able to read that from the data collected this year using the service that the report was made of. But I believe most of the cases have never reached a formal service, most of them we just handle within our families or sometimes with our chiefs.
E: And for those of you who may not know how it works here in Vanuatu, wanem we Polly hemi talem it’s through the kastom reconciliation part. And I understand as well, and I’ve heard that that’s the main go-to for a lot of women, especially the women living in communities. And so with the way things are going today, I understand there are a lot of different NGOs, government programs that have projects to help highlight the importance of preventing violence against women and girls. Do you think with the previous statistic that I mentioned earlier, that the number will increase or will it decrease, just thinking about all the information that’s being carried out there?
TRANSLATIONS: And for those of you who may not know how it works here in Vanuatu, what Polly mentioned, it’s through the kastom reconciliation part. And I understand as well, and I’ve heard that that’s the main go-to for a lot of women, especially the women living in communities. And so with the way things are going today, I understand there are a lot of different NGOs, government programs that have projects to help highlight the importance of preventing violence against women and girls. Do you think with the previous statistic that I mentioned earlier, that the number will increase or will it decrease, just thinking about all the information that’s currently being put out there?
PWD: I think usually what you would see is people become more aware of what the law is and the fact that they are able to report. The thing is you’ll see a spike because all the cases that we didn’t know about are suddenly coming forward.
E: Yeah.
PWD: So, what you should see is a steady increase in reports. That doesn’t mean though that there’s more rape than there used to be, or there’s more violence than there used to be, it just means that more people have the information and are able to come forward. What you would hope to see over time with lots and lots of awareness, but not just awareness, service provision and effective responses to those reports, you would hope to see behavior change and long-term offenses. But that is a huge change that takes generations and I don’t think there’s a country in the world that has succeeded in eliminating violence against women, unfortunately.
E: Now for the legal perspective, again for those of you who may not know, Polly has a background in law. You studied in Australia and worked in Australia for 10 years. And for the legislation here in Vanuatu, I understand that in the penal code it has been amended from it being rape to now sexual intercourse without consent. I just want to understand why this was amended, why isn’t the court recognizing it as rape, why are they now recognizing it as sexual intercourse without consent?
PWD: Ok, I just want to preface this with saying that I am not a criminal lawyer. I do do a lot of work now with the legislation around domestic and sexual violences, but when I practiced I wasn’t practicing as a criminal lawyer in my field of law’s employment. But having said that, I think in the language changes it’s actually been about broadening what can be recognized by a court as what we would say rape. When you hear that word ‘rape’, traditionally many of us picture a man using a lot of force, sorry excuse me I hope I don’t offend anyone, but to penetrate a woman with his penis. That is the traditional thing that comes to mind when you think about rape and it’s usually a very scary situation where someone is using a lot of physical force to do that. But rape can occur in a much broader spectrum of behaviors than just that. And so by using the words ‘sexual intercourse’, we can provide a definition that goes beyond just a man penetrating a woman, but can involve the use of objects, and can involve other parts of the body being violated. So it’s quite a technical kind of legal perspective, but really it’s about providing for the full range of behavior that constitutes the violation of someone’s body. And taem yumi talem ‘without consent’, yumi minim se i nogat agrimen. So nara samting tu hemi se plante taem yumi tingbaot rep, yumi tingbaot force. But really what it is is it’s an activity without the agreement of the other person, hemi no agri blong yu mekem fasin ia. And i gat fulap situation we might i nogat agrimen we i moa bitim jes hemia we hemi faetem hem. Sometimes force happens in other ways.
TRANSLATIONS: Ok, I just want to preface this with saying that I am not a criminal lawyer. I do do a lot of work now with the legislation around domestic and sexual violences, but when I practiced I wasn’t practicing as a criminal lawyer in my field of law’s employment. But having said that, I think in the language changes it’s actually been about broadening what can be recognized by a court as what we would say rape. When you hear that word ‘rape’, traditionally many of us picture a man using a lot of force, sorry excuse me I hope I don’t offend anyone, but to penetrate a woman with his penis. That is the traditional thing that comes to mind when you think about rape and it’s usually a very scary situation where someone is using a lot of physical force to do that. But rape can occur in a much broader spectrum of behaviors than just that. And so by using the words ‘sexual intercourse’, we can provide a definition that goes beyond just a man penetrating a woman, but can involve the use of objects, and can involve other parts of the body being violated. So it’s quite a technical kind of legal perspective, but really it’s about providing for the full range of behavior that constitutes the violation of someone’s body. And when we say ‘without consent’, it just means that there wasn’t some sort of agreement. So another thing is that many times when we think of rape, we think of force. But really what it is is it’s an activity without the agreement of the other person, they don’t agree for you to do this type of behavior. And there’s many situations where there is no agreement that is more than just the rape. Sometimes force happens in other ways.
E: True, thank you for explaining that. I think for me, I was a confused I guess, because I didn’t really have that experience with working in the legal sector in Vanuatu. And so for me, I was a little taken aback like “well why aren’t they just using rape, because it’s rape?”, but with that explanation I can understand that now. And people weren’t misinterpreting it or anything, it was just that everything was laid out, and assuming when cases came up it was covered more. And you mentioned that rape isn’t just a man penetrating his penis into a woman’s vagina, but it can also be an object. And I don’t think a lot of people know that and now that that’s stated in the penal code, that rape or sexual intercourse without consent can also happen with objects. And so with that perception of maybe not a lot of people know this, how do you think people, maybe in the community or just around Port Vila interpret rape and why is there some misinformation or are we not really defining rape is, especially according to our legislation?
PWD: Sure. I think it’s common understanding blong yumi evriwan, and we can all sympathize or empathize with that idea of the stranger forcing a woman to have sex she doesn’t want to have in a very violent imagery type way. And that’s one that I think the community, bae mi talem olsem se they accept that it’s been a rape, that it’s been a violation of this person. Be I think taem yumi tokbaot ol broader ranges blong situations we rep i save happen, particularly for example if a woman is drunk and passes out and she’s taken advantage of and violated, we don’t often think of that as rape, we think of that as her fault because she was drunk and she fell asleep. Or if it’s for example, one of the most common places that rape happens very sadly, is in the home. It is often, the person who rapes the victim is her family member or a close friend or someone who they know very well. And that I think we find it a lot harder to sympathize with and to understand because it feels so, there’s lots of reasons why, but I think for many people that just is hard to accept that this is the reality of what is happening in people’s homes. And so we find ways of blaming the woman who the rape has happened to so that we can find a reason for why this horrible thing happened, that there is an easy explanation or she must’ve done something wrong. So I think a lot of the time when the community talks about rape we think a lot about “what did she do to deserve that? Hemi mekem wanem nao man ia i repem hem?”. And that’s often the first question that people ask, “ating hemi stap wokbaot hem wan long naet” or “ating hemi drong” or “ating hemi aftarem man ia nomo ale naoia hemi stap kiaman”. There’s a lot of those kinds of things that we will say about rape. And there’s lots of things we don’t talk about in our communities at all, unfortunately, the rape that happens to men and boys, which does happen. But we find it very hard to talk about and acknowledge and it may not be the large proportion of cases but it certainly does happen. So I think there’s lots of ways and lots of different reasons for lack of education and awareness, but to gender beliefs in our society about gender and the position of men and women in society, that has a huge impact on how we perceive all sorts of interactions between men and women but especially sexual interactions and rape. Taem we yumi tingbaot wan samting olsem sex in a marriage situation, often because of the bride price there is a belief that man hemi pem woman, eni taem hemi wantem sex hemi gat raet blong gat sex. And so we don’t think of a husband raping his wife, we just think that that’s what she has to give him because that’s what he’s paid for long wan saed. So hemi gat fulap difdifren tingting i kam insaed, sorry I’m probably not being very clear there.
TRANSLATIONS: Sure. I think it’s common understanding for everyone, and we can all sympathize or empathize with that idea of the stranger forcing a woman to have sex she doesn’t want to have in a very violent imagery type way. And that’s one that I think the community, I don’t know how to say but they accept that it’s been a rape, that it’s been a violation of this person. But I think when we talk about the broader ranges of these situations where rape can happen, particularly for example if a woman is drunk and passes out and she’s taken advantage of and violated, we don’t often think of that as rape, we think of that as her fault because she was drunk and she fell asleep. Or if it’s for example, one of the most common places that rape happens very sadly, is in the home. It is often, the person who rapes the victim is her family member or a close friend or someone who they know very well. And that I think we find it a lot harder to sympathize with and to understand because it feels so, there’s lots of reasons why, but I think for many people that just is hard to accept that this is the reality of what is happening in people’s homes. And so we find ways of blaming the woman who the rape has happened to so that we can find a reason for why this horrible thing happened, that there is an easy explanation or she must’ve done something wrong. So I think a lot of the time when the community talks about rape we think a lot about “what did she do to deserve that? What did she do that a man raped her?”. And that’s often the first question that people ask, “maybe she was walking alone at night” or “maybe she was drunk” or “maybe she went after that man herself and now she’s just lying”. There’s a lot of those kinds of things that we will say about rape. And there’s lots of things we don’t talk about in our communities at all, unfortunately, the rape that happens to men and boys, which does happen. But we find it very hard to talk about and acknowledge and it may not be the large proportion of cases but it certainly does happen. So I think there’s lots of ways and lots of different reasons for lack of education and awareness, but to gender beliefs in our society about gender and the position of men and women in society, that has a huge impact on how we perceive all sorts of interactions between men and women but especially sexual interactions and rape. When we think about sex in a marriage situation, often because of the bride price there is a belief that the man pays for the woman, and any time he wants to have sex then he has the right to get sex. And so we don’t think of a husband raping his wife, we just think that that’s what she has to give him because that’s what he’s paid for. So there’s many different ideas that come inside, sorry I’m probably not being very clear there.
E: No, no that’s clear. Hemi tru fulap pipol oli biliv se the bride price taem wan man hemi mekem, evri samting woman i mas folem nomo. And it hurts to see when the woman does bring up something that’s happened, if she’s been forced by her husband to have sex and the immediate reaction for most family members will be “but that’s fine, hemi man blong yu, mifala sakem mani finis that’s your issue now”. And so that, for me, it hurts to see that yes we’re not supporting or trying to support these women who go through these different issues.
TRANSLATIONS: No, no that’s clear. That is true as people believe that when a man provides the bride price, everything that happens, the woman has to follow. And it hurts to see when the woman does bring up something that’s happened, if she’s been forced by her husband to have sex and the immediate reaction for most family members will be “but that’s fine, he is your husband, we already paid the price, that’s your issue now”. And so that, for me, it hurts to see that yes we’re not supporting or trying to support these women who go through these different issues.
PWD: That’s right. And there’s a lot of shame attached to rape so plante taem taem we wan person hemi eksperiensem rep, already she’s been violated and gone through this horrific, traumatic event. But then she’s also made to feel ashamed and responsible for what happened to her, which adds to the trauma that she’s gone through. And it also makes it a lot harder to speak out, even long kalja blong yumi sex hemi no wan samting we yumi stap tokbaot really, and that’s even consensual sex we don’t talk about. Yumi talem se hemi tabu and hemi wan samting we yumi no wantem tokbaot. And then taem yu putum se rep, hemi kam wan even moa had samting blong tokbaot. And often if someone is raped in the community, you have the whispers and the gossips, “gel ia nao we oli repem hem las taem ia” and “bae hemi neva save faenem wan man we bae wantem hem nao from oli spolem hem finis”. You know it’s those like she’s been spoiled, she’s been tarnished, instead of lifting her up and saying “you’ve been through this awful thing and we’re going to make things better for you now”. We heap on a layer of shame that makes it even harder for people to speak about what they’ve gone through.
TRANSLATIONS: That’s right. And there’s a lot of shame attached to rape so many times when a person experiences rape, already she’s been violated and gone through this horrific, traumatic event. But then she’s also made to feel ashamed and responsible for what happened to her, which adds to the trauma that she’s gone through. And it also makes it a lot harder to speak out, even in our culture sex isn’t something that we talk about, and that’s even consensual sex we don’t talk about. We say that it is taboo and something we don’t want to talk about. And then when we say rape, it becomes even more hard to talk about. And often if someone is raped in the community, you have the whispers and the gossips, “that’s the girl that was raped last time” and “she’ll never be able to find a man that’ll want to be with her beccause she is already ruined”. You know it’s those things like she’s been spoiled, she’s been tarnished, instead of lifting her up and saying “you’ve been through this awful thing and we’re going to make things better for you now”. We heap on a layer of shame that makes it even harder for people to speak about what they’ve gone through.
E: Exactly. There’s a lot of blaming, like you’ve mentioned, people always find, bae oli faenem wei blong oli tanem i gobak long gel ia blong talem se “well what were you wearing” for instance. And I think that comes up a lot. And so I just want to hear your thoughts as well when it comes to people blaming what the survivor was wearing, I think another thing as well is what time of the day was she walking, either in the community or around town. “Was it late at night? Well if it was late at night, she should have been at home, what was she doing?”. And so there are all these different ways and reasons that people try to put the blame back on the girl. And so what do you think when people start to blame, particularly when they try to blame it on what the girl was wearing?
PWD: Great, thank you. Hemi wan very common tingting se sapos yu werem wan klos we hemi soem aot bodi blong yu, yu stap attractem ae blong ol man and then bae oli wantem repem yu. I find that belief is problematic on so many levels, fes samting hemi no even tru from plante rep i happen taem woman i werem aelan dress, taem woman i werem longfala sket, taem woman i werem traosis, even when women oli conform long evri samting we man i askem long olgeta, yu dress ap olsem, gudfala woman olsem, they can still be raped. Women are raped wearing all sorts of different things and so I would say rape has nothing to do with dressing up, but I think the other thing that’s really dangerous about this idea of dressing up is, what we’re effectively saying is ol man oli nogat control, ol man bae oli luk wan woman dress ap olsem ia bae oli olsem ia nomo bae oli wantem repem hem. That is putting men at such a base level, it’s saying that men can’t control their feelings, men are basically like animalistic. I mean if I’m a man I wouldn’t want people to think that I have absolutely no ability to control my normal human desires and mi tingse hemi really impoten blong yumi mekem ol pipol oli tingting deep about this one. Like you and I can see a person walk past and think “well they’re attractive”, but we don’t want to take that step to violate them in a really awful way and I think we have to really challenge those ideas about like “dressing up bae lid i go long rep”. Fulap ol komuniti blong yumi oli blokem ol woman blong no werem traosis, blong no werem shot sket and still rep i stap gohed long ol komuniti ia. Rape happens to small children, don’t tell me that rape of a 3 year old or a 5 year old has anything to do with what that child is wearing. Like I said most rapes oli happen insaed long own home blong victim and hemi usually wan man we hemi save gud hem and unfortunately a lot of the times hemi wan famle memba. And hemia i nogat eni samting to do wetem klos we victim hemi werem, and yumi save finis se stamba cause blong vaelens agensem ol woman hemi paoa mo control. And it’s when people in society who have power want to use that power to abuse and violate somebody else. And unfortunately in our society, men have a lot more power than women and men are taught from a very early age that sex is your right and you can demand it and a woman who violates our moral beliefs is someone who you’re allowed to do bad things to and you won’t be held responsible. So wan nara samting about victim blaming olsem hemi wan wei blong yumi faenem wan isi ansa. And also unfortunately a lot of women can blame other women, it’s not just men who engage in victim blaming and I think it’s about kind of trying to believe that society is fair so that nothing bad will happen to you if you’re a good person. So if I dress up properly, if I am really obedient and good I would never have anything bad happen to me, so then if something bad does happen to someone we know we start to find ways to hold them responsible so that we can still believe that if I’m a good moral person, nothing bad will happen to me. And it’s kind of like trying to find this very easy answer for why this thing happened rather than having to think about whether these are really core beliefs at the root of our society that maybe we need to challenge, which is very hard to do. Mo hemi tekem yumi blong lukluk bigwan insaed long yumi wan and our own judgments, the way we judge other people, it requires a lot more self reflection than being able to say “she did something wrong that’s why that happened to her”.
TRANSLATIONS: Great, thank you. This is a very common issue where if you wear something that is revealing people think you are trying the attract men’s attention and then they’ll want to rape you. I find that belief is problematic on so many levels, the first thing is that it is not even true as many rapes can happen when a woman wears an island dress, when a woman wears a long skirt, when a woman wears pants, even when women conform to everything men ask, you dress up, your a good woman, they can still be raped. Women are raped wearing all sorts of different things and so I would say rape has nothing to do with dressing up, but I think the other thing that’s really dangerous about this idea of dressing up is, what we’re effectively saying is men don’t have control, when men see a woman dressed up however they’ll want to rape her. That is putting men at such a base level, it’s saying that men can’t control their feelings, men are basically animalistic. I mean if I’m a man I wouldn’t want people to think that I have absolutely no ability to control my normal human desires and I think it’s really important that we let people think deeper about this. Like you and I can see a person walk past and think “well they’re attractive”, but we don’t want to take that step to violate them in a really awful way and I think we have to really challenge those ideas about like “dressing up leads to rape”. Many communities block women to not wear pants, short skirts but still rape still happens in these communities. Rape happens to small children, don’t tell me that rape of a 3 year old or a 5 year old has anything to do with what that child is wearing. Like I said most rapes happen in the homes of the victim and usually it is someone they know well and unfortunately a lot of the times it is a family member. And this has nothing to do with the clothes the victim wears, and we already know that the root of the problem for violence against women is power and control. And it’s when people in society who have power want to use that power to abuse and violate somebody else. And unfortunately in our society, men have a lot more power than women and men are taught from a very early age that sex is your right and you can demand it and a woman who violates our moral beliefs is someone who you’re allowed to do bad things to and you won’t be held responsible. So another thing about victim blaming is finding an easy answer. And also unfortunately a lot of women can blame other women, it’s not just men who engage in victim blaming and I think it’s about kind of trying to believe that society is fair so that nothing bad will happen to you if you’re a good person. So if I dress up properly, if I am really obedient and good I would never have anything bad happen to me, so then if something bad does happen to someone we know we start to find ways to hold them responsible so that we can still believe that if I’m a good moral person, nothing bad will happen to me. And it’s kind of like trying to find this very easy answer for why this thing happened rather than having to think about whether these are really core beliefs at the root of our society that maybe we need to challenge, which is very hard to do. And it allows us to take a look within ourselves and our own judgments, the way we judge other people, it requires a lot more self reflection than being able to say “she did something wrong that’s why that happened to her”.
E: Yeah, I think that’s brought up a lot, or me just listening to it, I can, I hope that other women will be able, and hopefully men will be able to relate to how frustrating it is when people blame what the victim was wearing and all of the other reasons that people try and find the easy answer to put it back on the victim. I also feel like a lot of people will focus on the incident itself or focus on, again, blaming the victim, but then they also forget the damage and the trauma that is now on the survivor, particularly the emotional and mental wellbeing of the survivor. So with that being said, I do understand and I’m very certain that a lot of people know that Vanuatu Women’s Center is the go-to service that women can go to, any survivor can go to if they need help or support. But are there any other current services that we have in Vanuatu that can help survivors or is this something that we are lacking?
PWD: Thanks, that’s an excellent question. And as you rightly pointed out the trauma of sexual violence is one that can last a lifetime, and samting we plante long yumi no stap recognizem mo yumi no stap tokbaot, mental health in general hemi no wan conversation we hemi common long kaontri blong yumi. So I think often we expect people to just get on with their lives even when they’ve been through really awful things like this. But there are definitely services around, one service that I think is often forgotten about is the health service because sexual violence can cause STDs, it can cause someone to become pregnant when they don’t want to be. But what a lot of people don’t know is that if you access a clinic within 72 hours of having been raped, you can be provided with medication to prevent STIs and to prevent unwanted pregnancies. So one of the most critical things for a person who’s been raped is to get to a medical center to have those medications administered and then if the survivor does want to report it to police, obviously wan clinic bae hemi save givim medical ripot we bae hemi save kam olsem wan evidence we bae oli putum long court blong pruvum case. Be wan samting long kaontri blong yumi hemi geography hemi very had so plante long ol helt senta might oli nogat ol sem seves evriwan and especially taem yu go aot moa rurol mo rimot, wanem we yu save kasem hemi no semak olsem wanem we yu save kasem long central eria. So hemia tu hemi wan bigfala challenge blong ol seves provaeda. Be yumi gat kolosap evri aelan mo evri vilej i gat wan helt senta, o wan clinic kolosap. Sam might bae oli gat ol meresin, sam might i nogat. So health services are one and of course there’s the government health clinics but also there’s the clinics like the Family Health Association, we oli gat ol clinics we oli save mekem ol sem samting olsem ol gavman clinic and i gat clinic blong kam pusum hed daon long Wan Smolbag, long Tagabe and tu long Luganville, so there’s the health service aspect. Then there’s the counseling so yu rightly mentionem Vanuatu Women’s Center as wan incredible seves blong ol woman mo ol gel and boys who are under 18. People often think of it as just women but young boys are also able to access all the services. And that’s counseling, that’s legal advice, that’s referrals to other justice agencies like the police, and importantly all of Vanuatu Women’s Center’s services are free. And sapos yu nogat mani blong kasem ofis blong olgeta, oli gat wan fri kol namba 161 and yu save askem sapot blong wan finance blong kasem ofis sapos yu nidim help blong transport fund. So hemi really wan incredible seves we hemi stap blong helpem ol pipol we oli go tru long ol rabis fasin olsem ia. We do have through our Vila Central Hospital wan seves oli kolem Mind Care Unit, olgeta oli mekem sam counseling especially long saed blong if you’re going through severe mental health issues such as post-traumatic stress disorder we yu stap fesem ol memory blong wanem i happen yu stap kambak evri taem and yu stap gat trabol olsem you’re triggered by certain places or you’re just not feeling like you’re coping very well mentally, obviously Mind Care Unit hemi wan ples we i gat ol mental health nurse we oli save mekem counseling wetem yu and givim yu sam strategies blong hao blong cope wetem wanem yu stap eksperiensem. Bakegen geographical challenge hemi big bigwan so seves ia hemi very centralized long ol hospital long Vila wetem long Luganville. Seves provision long Vanuatu hemi very challenging from yumi gat 82 aelan, rod i nogud, sam ples boat nomo i kasem, it’s incredibly expensive for lots of people and for service providers too, and that is an ongoing challenge. There are also services through the police, of course, we sapos yu wantem mekem wan criminal ripot we bae i end ap long court then of course yumi gat long plante ples bae yu gat Family Protection Unit we oli dil wetem ol sexual offenses we i happen insaed long ol famle as well as domestic violence. And then yu gat serious crimes investigations we oli kolem ol unit CID and then some places oli gat ol morality units so seves blong police hemi kasem evri aelan but bakegen some islands have more police officers than others and the police are working very hard to improve the reach of policing services. Those would be probably the main services that are available, there are lots of NGOs that are out there doing awareness work and some doing some work around counseling support and things like that. But in terms of formal service provision that’s what we have at the moment, I think there’s obviously a lot more that could be there particularly in that counseling space, but as I said the challenges are significant, there aren’t a lot of resources and there has been some incredible work that’s happened to really extend the reach of services across the country.
TRANSLATIONS: Thanks, that’s an excellent question. And as you rightly pointed out the trauma of sexual violence is one that can last a lifetime, and something that a lot of people don’t recognize and we don’t talk about is mental health in general as it isn’t a conversation that is common in our country. So I think often we expect people to just get on with their lives even when they’ve been through really awful things like this. But there are definitely services around, one service that I think is often forgotten about is the health service because sexual violence can cause STDs, it can cause someone to become pregnant when they don’t want to be. But what a lot of people don’t know is that if you access a clinic within 72 hours of having been raped, you can be provided with medication to prevent STIs and to prevent unwanted pregnancies. So one of the most critical things for a person who’s been raped is to get to a medical center to have those medications administered and then if the survivor does want to report it to police, obviously the clinic can provide a medical report that can be used as evidence that can go through court to prove the case. But something about our country is the geography and how it is very hard to get access so plenty of health centers might not provide the same services especially in rural and remote areas, what one can get won’t be the same as what one would get in the central areas. So this is also a big challenge for service providers. But in almost every island and every village there is a health center or a clinic. But some of them might have enough medicine while others don’t have any. So health services are one and of course there’s the government health clinics but also there’s the clinics like the Family Health Association, where there are the clinics that do the same thing like what the government clinics do and there are some clinics like the one down at Wan Smolbag, at Tagabe and also at Luganville, so there’s the health service aspect. Then there’s the counseling so you rightly mentioned Vanuatu Women’s Center as an incredible service provided for women, girls and boys who are under 18. People often think of it as just women but young boys are also able to access all the services. And that’s counseling, that’s legal advice, that’s referrals to other justice agencies like the police, and importantly all of Vanuatu Women’s Center’s services are free. And if you don’t have money to get to their office, they have a free call line 161 and you can ask for support with finance to get to their office. So it’s really an incredible service that can help people that have gone through these situations. We do have through our Vila Central Hospital with service that call the Mind Care Unit, and they make sure that you get counseling especially on the side of if you’re going through severe mental health issues such as post-traumatic stress disorder we you face memories of past experiences giving you trouble when you’re triggered by certain places or you’re just not feeling like you’re coping very well mentally, obviously Mind Care Unit is a place that have mental health nurses that can do counseling sessions with you and give you some strategies of how to cope with what you’re experiencing. Again the geographical challenge is very big so this service is very centralized with the hospital in Vila and in Luganville. Service provision in Vanuatu is challenging as we have 82 islands, some roads may be of poor quality, some places are only accessible by boat, it’s incredibly expensive for lots of people and for service providers too, and that is an ongoing challenge. There are also services through the police, of course, where if you want to provide a criminal report that will end up in court then of course we have plenty of places like the Family Protection Unit where they deal with sexual offenses that happen in a family as well as domestic violence. And then you have serious crimes and investigations where they can call a unit called the CID and then some places have morality units so the service provided by the police can reach all the islands but again some islands have more police officers than others and the police are working very hard to improve the reach of policing services. Those would be probably the main services that are available, there are lots of NGOs that are out there doing awareness work and some doing some work around counseling support and things like that. But in terms of formal service provision that’s what we have at the moment, I think there’s obviously a lot more that could be there particularly in that counseling space, but as I said the challenges are significant, there aren’t a lot of resources and there has been some incredible work that’s happened to really extend the reach of services across the country.
E: Thank you Polly. That was more information, I think I only really understood that Vanuatu Women’s Center did provide counseling, that there was the Mind Care clinic for any post-traumatic stress. Would the survivor have to openly tell them that they’ve been raped and that they would like this particular medication or can they just ask for that medication?
PWD: I don’t work in the health space so I’m not sure if there’s any sort of particular protocol. My understanding of how it should work is that it shouldn’t be something where you’d have to disclose that you were raped, it would be that you would have to state that you had unprotected sex within the last 72 hours. But again I don’t work in health so I probably would leave that to, yes.
E: Leave it to them to explain, but that’s fine. Thank you so much, that was a lot of information and I’m sure there’s a lot of people out there who don’t know that these are the services that we have, taking note again that these service will be able to provide everything that you’ve mentioned specifically in Port Vila and Luganville, it will depend across our islands here in Vanuatu.
PWD: I should add, of course, in the community we have incredible people who work to support community members who experience awful things. So there are some chiefs and some pastors and community leaders who have been excellent advocates to help their people get justice services, get them to hospitals, get them to health centers. And in Santo there’s a program that I’ve been working with called the Authorized Person Program and those are community members who are appointed to issue temporary protection orders in situations of family violence. But they also make referrals for more serious cases and they work very closely with community leaders as well and I think that’s also one of the strengths of our community too is that there are often leaders who will show a lot of initiative in helping people access services that they may not otherwise be able to access, and in helping to respond to some of these things that happen.
E: Thank you. Before we wrap this episode up, I just wanted to also get your thoughts on, I think this is my personal observation, a lot of times when another woman will open up usually to another woman that maybe they’ve been raped or that they have experienced some sort of violence from their partner, the immediate response, particularly for those living in town is “well go and report it to the police, go to Vanuatu Women’s Center, what are you doing?”. And I just wanted to get your thoughts, is this something that you encourage or in your professional opinion as well, is this something that people should be encouraging like going straight to the police? I feel like maybe with all the information and awareness going around as well, people began, in town, this is my observation in town, people will think automatically that “ok the police are there to help in these situations”.
PWD: I think everything in terms of what a person does in response to something like sexual violence or family violence, it’s their decision and their decision needs to be respected and sometimes that won’t be what we think would be best for them. Obviously being someone who works in the law, I strongly believe that the more reports that happen, the better. Because then we get more of a sense as a community of what is happening in our society and we understand that these are issues we need to then address and put more resources into.
E: Thank you so much Polly for joining me on today’s episode. I know that this topic can be very sensitive to talk about but guys, it’s necessary. These are the kinds of conversations we need to have in order to shift the perspective, shift the narrative of finding the easy answer which is blaming the victim, we need to bring focus on the perpetrator. Violating someone like Polly said is against the law but it’s also morally wrong, we need to realize that it’s not the survivors fault, it’s never the survivors fault. And we need to encourage and support the survivor to go to these services we have available while also understanding that at the end of the day it is up to the survivor whether they want the support or not. If you or anyone you know is a survivor and needs support please reach out to the services we have available such as Vanuatu Women’s Center.
Conclusion
E: Make sure to check us out on Facebook, Instagram and TikTok at Sista Vanuatu and our website sista.com.vu. This is Elsie, from The RoundTable. If you want to hear more from The RoundTable podcast, make sure to tune in to the next episode.
